[DoctorEldritch]

Originally Posted by DracoTarot

On the other hand, I also feel some are made up just to fit in with the specific crowd even though the person or persons does not really know what the culture is all about.

Not necessarily a bad thing, though. Some may like the music, but not clothing or "philosophy", so what should those people do? It is better for them to select the parts of a subculture that they like and ignore the ones they do not care that much about rather than to deprive themselves of something they enjoy altogether.

But then, some say subcultures should really work as an "all-or-nothing" package, and that you can only "get" the music and lyrics completely if you share the underlying ideology.

All so subjective and complicated...

[DracoTarot]

@DoctorEldritch I do believe in the "all-or-nothing" package. The reason why, I had too many encounters with people who pretend they are part of a certain culture and it can be quite embarrassing sometimes.

For example, a person who wears a band t-shirt just because they like the artwork but they are unable to name a song or even the members of the band. It's not necessarily a bad thing depending on the occasion. If I was invited to a "themed" party or occasion and dressed accordingly It's acceptable.

When the imagery, fashion, practices, music, or artefacts of culture are adopted and the original contexts are ignored, I do have a problem with it.

[DoctorEldritch]

@DracoTarot I am not as strict about it myself. If someone likes music but doesn't really like to wear goth clothes, I want to say, you do you. It gets more complicated when cultural aspects become involved, but I generally am more lenient about these things. Partially because I do not really consider myself belonging to any subculture like that, I think, so it is a bit hard for me to emphasize with strong feelings about them.

[DracoTarot]

@DoctorEldritch I'm really not judging. It is all about groups that have values, norms, and/or cultural patterns that set the group apart from the larger society.

[DoctorEldritch]

@DracoTarot subcultures are interesting this way, they connect people with different common points: music taste, fashion style, personal philosophy, political views, and so forth. And those are complicated subjects, people in the same subculture may not necessarily feel the same or equally strongly about them. I guess that's why there are those "degrees of hardcoreness"...

[DracoTarot]

@DoctorEldritch Sometimes a bit of "firmness" is needed to keep things running smoothly otherwise the remaining subcultures may fall apart just like others did.

[DoctorEldritch]

@DracoTarot But it is a natural process for subcultures to disappear and appear as global culture evolves, is it not? They change, gain and lose influence, all part of the march of civilization. Hippies, for instance, used to be much bigger than they are now.

[DracoTarot]

@DoctorEldritch True, subcultures do disappear and reappear. I just can't seem to get used to the "new norm" concept. Changes need to happen and are part of the evolution...I get it. Call me old-fashioned but I am still following traditional ways and sticking to the roots from where it all started.

Our subculture mostly went underground and we gather where others do not. Call us a secret society or a cult if you will.

[DoctorEldritch]

@DracoTarot sticking to the roots is good and all, but all is well in moderation. The upcoming Assassin's Creed Mirage goes to the roots in a sense where the protagonist had to cut off a finger "voluntarily". Atmospheric though it is, maybe that's a bit too deep.

Maybe you have a secret handshake instead?

[DracoTarot]

@DoctorEldritch 😂. We wouldn't go to that extreme. As soon as I have to offer a digit I'd rather retreat.

We do not hold any secrets and our clubs are open to anyone interested. No initiation is needed only a true understanding of the subculture is a must. We're a bunch of old people who stick to the old ways.

On the other hand, some of us in the group are Freemasons. I, unfortunately, do not have the status or privilege to join. My bloodline does not allow it. Would've been interesting to see the inner workings of the society.